Woman-Owned Wallet: The Podcast
The Woman-Owned Wallet is a bold, feminist marketplace that features goods from over 50 woman-owned brands. Founder and serial entrepreneur, Amanda Dare, has expanded her brand by creating a walking tour of other woman-owned shops in one of the most popular areas in Louisville, KY, and now, she is also encouraging conversations about money with women through Woman-Owned Wallet: The Podcast. Amanda shares honest conversations with a fellow woman in business to discuss all of their WOW money moments with their finances: both the good and the bad.
Woman-Owned Wallet: The Podcast
52 | Kana Brown on Finding Harmony in the Chaos Through Professional Evolution
On this episode of the podcast, Amanda is joined by the effervescent Kana Brown, as their conversation ebbs and flows through the tapestry of life's unspoken complexities. Their candid chat unearths the dichotomy of societal expectations against the backdrop of personal joys, uncovering how chain restaurant dinners and the anticipation of a Kentucky Derby can reveal profound truths about the hustle and balance in our lives. This heartfelt episode peels back the layers of entrepreneurship, friendships, and the pursuit of harmony amidst the chaos of the modern world.
Their narrative stretches even further, touching on earnest challenges of family dynamics and the unconventional paths of entrepreneurship. The conversation navigates the nuances of self-employment and confronts the realities of personal health within family dynamics. They wrap up the conversation by exploring the evolution of language, the empowerment of women, and the profound joy that's discovered in forging deeper friendships beyond the workplace. Listen in and perhaps see your own reflection in the tales of growth, resilience, and the courage to tread your unique path!
Hey friends, welcome to Woman-Owned Wallet the podcast. I'm your host, amanda Dare, a serial entrepreneur who has already made all of the money mistakes, so you don't have to Now. I'm working on my money mindset, expanding my companies and having open conversations with women around a subject that shouldn't be so taboo money. My company, woman-owned Wallet, and I are determined to help you foster a more positive relationship with your wallet and help you create a life that makes you say wow, hey moneymakers, welcome back to another episode of Woman Owned Wallet the podcast. I'm Amanda Dare and I'm here with one of my very best friends now. I mean, we just enjoyed unlimited breadsticks soup salad.
Speaker 2:How can you not be best friends after that?
Speaker 1:Right, so welcome, so so so much. However, you're supposed to welcome people that you love to anything but welcome to the podcast Kena Brown, hey Hi.
Speaker 2:What's going on, just you know. Ready to spill the tea.
Speaker 1:I know it should be like woman owned tea We'll think of it.
Speaker 2:We're just a maid service.
Speaker 1:We just clean up the tea. Yeah, I'll just mop it up. We're ready, yeah, I'm ready for a therapy session. Oh, I'm ready to be your therapist. Sometimes I do think of myself as an entrepreneur therapist. Yeah, it does often happen. Lately I've been needing the therapy.
Speaker 2:Hey, we all have to switch roles sometimes.
Speaker 1:And that's what I appreciate you so much for. Because, y'all, last Friday I was like literally in therapy and when I got out of it I had a message from Kana and I was like she was like hey, do you want to go to lunch later? I was like, yes, nobody ever invites me to like lunch. Like I was like I felt so cool and then she was like, oh, where should we go? And like I find that crazy.
Speaker 2:Everyone I know knows you and I'm like how are they seeing and meeting you and talking?
Speaker 1:to you if you're not like out with them like they come here and I sit here and then they ask me questions to help them, oh okay. And like I love that and I love them and there's nothing wrong with that, but like to just be like, hey, friend, you probably need some friend time. I want to go like it's Oaks Day, yeah, and for those that don't know, like Derby was last week, so on the day before the Kentucky Derby, which we're in Louisville and that's what we're known for. It was the 150.
Speaker 2:Fancy. It was so fancy I had serious FOMO, but it's propelling me for next year Like someone. Better invite me to Derby next year, but then I'll be sad if it wasn't as cool as this year.
Speaker 1:Yeah, did you see the like photo finish too? It was like mystic Dan, I think, one which my brother's name is, daniel.
Speaker 2:But listen, it's very conflicting, because I just learned that the horses are all born at the same time and you're not actually supposed to race them until they're like three years old.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but they are three years old.
Speaker 2:Or maybe it was older than that. So, whatever age they were telling me, it was like oh, they're actually racing them like maybe two years, maybe it's just like too early, yeah, and that's why they die so much, because they're like wearing them out. Aww, we're babes, I know it like. So I feel conflicted.
Speaker 1:I know it is going to win.
Speaker 2:I want to wear a hat and I want to get Like I don't want those horses to die.
Speaker 1:So it's just a very conflicting we just have to accept that they're not going to stop doing it, and they won't stop, except, you know, the circus barely exists anymore.
Speaker 2:So enough people get rowdy about it.
Speaker 1:It's mostly people Like let's just have people around the track that exists, I don't know, because at least they have a say, but I don't know, at least they have a say, but I don't know. Then people exploit them too. It's a whole problem that I'm not prepared to solve. Late stage capitalism, you know. But I really like Oaks, actually, because it's a day before Derby and that is like all the pink they celebrate. Of course I love pink. That's when they celebrate the breast cancer awareness, that's when all the girl horses run the fillies they run on Oaks. So I was just like oaks and like you called me on or you texted me on oaks to meet up, and I was just like, yeah, so we should have went to oaks. No, because once again it's like we just needed soup, salad, breadsticks and that chicken parmesan amazing.
Speaker 2:I am not a. What do you call that?
Speaker 1:Chain restaurant. Yeah, franchise chain, and I was like, so usually I would suggest like a small business.
Speaker 2:But sometimes, sometimes, and also I always rationalize people who work in the community or live in this community also work there, absolutely. So there's that aspect.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and we had. I hate that I think about stuff so much. Yeah, it's the worst and that's why we go home and get high and chill out because, like, there's so much to think about, so many levels Anyway.
Speaker 2:Way too aware of stuff I don't want to be aware. Like ignorance is true bliss.
Speaker 1:So we went and we were like okay, what was his name?
Speaker 2:Alex. No, I think he thought that was his name. I thought his name was Victor.
Speaker 1:So maybe it was Alex.
Speaker 2:Alex was such a cutie.
Speaker 1:He got me free tiramisu because I was like my birthday is this month. True Taurus, she's just out there trying to get snacks, all the snacks.
Speaker 2:And he was like why not? I was like great.
Speaker 1:Yeah, she was like what do I have to sign up for, because I'm not coming back here before my birthday. And he was like I'll just bring you a free dessert. And she was like okay. And then I was like really sad. I was like well, my birthday was two weeks ago. Should I be taking home tariffs too?
Speaker 2:But I was like you didn't go for it. He might have done it.
Speaker 1:I should have but you know, at the end of the day I got those three gravy boats of, like different sauces to dip my breadsticks and I was very happy. So know where we went? We went to Olive Garden and I felt like that was very obvious, but maybe it wasn't.
Speaker 2:Yeah but people listen, from all over the world listen. Olive Garden still exists.
Speaker 1:I didn't know that. It does smell like a chain restaurant. When you walk in there's a certain like a community pool.
Speaker 2:Oh, you know, like there's always don't say that because we ate there and I just I'm not saying it's not clean, the bleach smell just kind of permeates like everywhere.
Speaker 1:But it's also like the drinks were so cheap. I mean, we both ate. Remember, I was like feeling like some scarcity mindset around money that day and so I was like you know, you know. And then I was looking at our table and I was like the amount of dishes on this table of, like the breadsticks, the second bag of breadsticks, like the salad, the soups, salad soup, pasta, the pasta, tiramisu, exactly Don Julio drink. We looked at the bill and we're like it's $40. Which is crazy.
Speaker 2:I went to brunch the other day and just got maybe a brunch and a drink. It was $60 after tip, yeah.
Speaker 1:And I was just like man, I thought my meal alone would have been $40. Yeah, and I was like wait, but it was lunch prices. I guess you can spend a lot of in free time.
Speaker 2:So all that to say, you can still support franchises. It's okay. Sometimes it's more cost effective and a server there still lives in your community and needs money.
Speaker 1:Well, and somebody potentially local owns it.
Speaker 2:Yeah that's a possibility as well.
Speaker 1:Isn't it crazy that, like somebody owns the company that makes these like, everything Like there's so much shit around us right now and I'm like somebody makes nails all day. Somebody makes like disco balls all day.
Speaker 2:My dad is an engineer and he worked for this company that makes one part. It's like one part that goes on something super important, but I'm just like you don't know what it is, I don't know. This whole company just makes like a bolt. That's insane. But yeah, there's someone out there making something for everything.
Speaker 1:That's not for me. One bolt, I think it goes on a spaceship or something like that.
Speaker 2:One bolt, I think it goes on a spaceship or something like that. Well, of course.
Speaker 1:And you need a lot of bolts to like do stuff.
Speaker 2:Then you can't have it falling off in the middle of a mission.
Speaker 1:So I'm married to an engineer, and all day long. I'm sorry, I'm like I'm sorry.
Speaker 2:I'm sorry. No, it's great.
Speaker 1:He's cool.
Speaker 1:But I know a lot of engineers because, like we were in college together, he always says there's like the, the chatty kind that you know are work well with people, but most of them do not talk to people. Yeah, those are industrial engineers that like do continuous improvement projects, like my best friends, hey Tori, hey Caitlin. But then there's and like the ones that like can sell and talk between people, that like don't understand what the technical engineer is saying. And my husband, like as a liaison, I mean he has a very long title that's very fancy and that's awesome and I do know what it is, but I don't want to like out him. He hates every time I talk about him, so sorry, but it's definitely something that's like interesting when you like deep dive into like it takes like years to develop the things that we're doing.
Speaker 2:I'm like I'm just trying to like sell a sticker, yeah, and that will take me five minutes to make and like send off to wherever and then they send it back. But yeah, years of development it's like that immediate gratification.
Speaker 1:Thank you, I was. You just finished all my sentences and dip all my bread that needs to be a card for valentine's day next year.
Speaker 1:I would do this yeah, in every sauce. Yeah, for the pansexuals, that's true. Yeah, no, it does listen. When I get into more greeting cards, I'll put that on there, write it down. You're going to forget. Oh, I already did. Luckily it's on this podcast and somebody will listen to me like where's this card? I'll be like, oh, yeah, I'll finally make it for you.
Speaker 1:Well, anyway, so we're hanging out and I was so excited because, like yeah, I am friends with all these people, but we're all just so often in business situations Like it's not usually a Friday at 2 pm when we're like hanging out and getting a cocktail, but in Louisville, derby week, nobody wants to do anything but go to Derby, and so, like all my meetings or not go to Derby Exactly, or like fully avoid it, so like none of my meetings were happening and all of that. So I was just so honored that you texted me and I was like, wow, this is just such the perfect timing. And like I was stressed out from like I needed that therapy session, like with my therapist that morning. And then I went to Von Mar because I was just like by the mall and I sat in their department store and the person was playing piano. Oh, and they were playing Disney music, which made me really happy because I'm Like, how fancy.
Speaker 1:It felt fancy, so I just sat and I listened to this old lady play piano, like Disney music, because I had to use the bathroom in there which, you know, like at Walmart, it's like a lounge, like it's fancy. I've never used the bathroom in there Go, because, like it's a full and I love a good bathroom selfie, so Full wall mirror, like the whole massive wall. I'm going to put it on my list. But do you remember, oh my gosh, do you remember when you used to go to the mall, like in high school? You're like, oh, this is such a good place to hang out.
Speaker 2:And now no, because I was raised Jehovah's Witness and we couldn't do anything secular outside of school.
Speaker 1:So I don't have those memories. She's the side high from Adrienne. She's like whoa, it's so interesting, Like so okay, so do you have a lot of siblings?
Speaker 2:I don't have one sister. We're 18 months apart. She's younger, Although she's always been like the older because she has two kids. She has one on the way currently. She's always been more adult than I am Adult or settled I don't know what the right term is for that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I gotcha. She gets to bring food to Traditional. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 2:Very traditional.
Speaker 1:She gets to bring food to where To any family gathering. She's allowed, you don't bring.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm only allowed to bring, like sodas or pre-made things.
Speaker 1:She's allowed to bring food.
Speaker 2:That's how I know she's a grown up. Yes, I think that's a really good marker. I don't know if that's across all cultures, but in black culture like, only like aunties, and up Really To bring food.
Speaker 1:Yes, so in my world of being a white girl, like they just make me do everything, oh, I mean, that's not true because I'm a terrible cook.
Speaker 2:But everything I mean that's not true because I'm a terrible cook, but so like your elders don't like because how do you know if the food is good?
Speaker 1:It's not good for my elders, okay, like love y'all and I'm talking about my mom and dad, yeah, but like most of the food growing up was like prepackaged or something like that, like I don't have any recipes to hand down or something like that. Like I don't have any recipes to hand down. So from my although I will say from like my husband's side his mom, great cook, his stepmom, amazing cook Like they're just they've had it, but just my grandma like didn't do that.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm scared for the day which it sounds like it's not going to come anytime soon. But, like the transfer of who does holidays or gatherings, like I've been doing them for years, oh goodness, I am not an adult enough to do that.
Speaker 1:I don't want to do that, even though you're eldest daughter, vibes. Yeah, I just want to show up and eat. I think it's what you step up for. But when you're ready, I just want to have the. I want it to be nice. Well, I will say I love posting entertaining.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I had a house with my ex-fiancee. Yeah, that was the whole thing. Like I wanted to make recipes in that house that would like be passed down to our children and I became very like into being domestic.
Speaker 1:But I had the drive like the drive and the reason domestic. Yeah, so you had that drive and the reason Domestic. Yeah, so you had that drive and then, but it's gone, it left. Yeah, we don't know her anymore. Okay, so growing up you had a sister, younger sister, and you're saying, like when it thunderstormed outside or when there was like a massive noise, you're like the apocalypse is starting. Oh, absolutely. And y'all like talked about that a lot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, well, the revelation, and you know, essentially in in that, is it a culture, in that religion, that only 144,000 people go to heaven? Um, the good and the righteous get to reside on a perfect paradise, and then the rest of us, well, they don't believe in hell. But, yeah, eternal death, essentially. So hell, yeah. And so I was like I'm not ready, like yeah, and then like there's, you know, the reckoning of who's good and bad, and so I'm like so you're just trying to be good, yeah, every day, all day.
Speaker 1:I could have tried harder maybe, and now.
Speaker 2:So, like, when did you start to like challenge that? Oh, I challenged it, even when I like during, but until I got out of my mom's house I could not, um, but I was the only one that, like my mom and my sister, are baptized. I did not get baptized during that time because I just knew it was like like this is kind of sus, I don't know, I want to go out in the world and see what's out there. It's not really that great. Don't be suspicious, don't be suspicious, don't be suspicious.
Speaker 1:I'll show up but Like I'm not going to like put you down all day, but like you know, it's not for me.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean even dating like you couldn't really date and if you did go on a date it had to be chaperoned, so like someone would come with you. I went on one date while I was still Jehovah's Witness and we went to Timbuktu. I still remember it and it was I even even like then it was awkward wait like you traveled? No, it was like uh, that was a gaming place, so like pinball machines, I was like dang they're really getting y'all.
Speaker 2:He's actually like quote, unquote, like I mean like a local celebrity, maybe even past that, I don't know, musician in Evansville.
Speaker 1:So I'm sure he remembers that date, my mom wanted me to marry him.
Speaker 2:so bad I'm like I think you want to marry him. I think you want to marry him. We're still good friends.
Speaker 1:So your mom and your sister.
Speaker 2:My mom, my sister, my grandma before she passed she was who kind of got my mom into it. So no holidays, which I was kind of I was talking about this earlier. It's like I don't mind that I didn't celebrate holidays, because even when I learned more about them outside of religion, it's just like okay, well, just another reason to spend money. So I love that I don't have the pressure of buying 20 gifts for people around Christmas. I am like I wouldn't say it's my top love language, but I do love receiving gifts, but I'm glad that, like you don't have to wait all year. Like, get me a gift whenever, don't wait till Christmas.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it's interesting. So maybe growing up not receiving gifts, now you're like, ooh, this is fun, it's like a fun way to interact as a love language.
Speaker 2:My mom was very good about always like not all the time, but making sure that we had gifts or things so that we didn't feel left out when we went to school. So I never felt like, oh, we don't get anything Right?
Speaker 1:Well, and what about birthdays?
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, no birthday. No, I do really love my birthday currently yeah love my birthday currently.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, I want to say, since I was 23 was about the age where I've, like, always had mostly really cool birthdays. Last year was probably the first year I didn't have a birthday party in a very long time, but it was a very tumultuous year. But, yeah, I mean, one of the years my best friend and my partner at the time threw me a Cana Palooza because I had never been to a music festival and I kept saying I wanted to go. The time threw me a canapalooza because I had never been to a music festival and I kept saying I wanted to go. And they threw me my own music festival. Wow, after they had surprised me, wouldn't tell me where we're going and drove me up to Nashville for a rose festival, and my friend was living in Tampa at the time, so she flew there to surprise me. So, like I, yeah, I love my birthday. Yeah, I don't know what I'm doing. This year, though, eating tiramisu.
Speaker 1:Probably we're gonna go get Alex, and I would like to do so in Italy.
Speaker 2:I'm gonna say there's any uh sugar daddies or mamas on here and you need to find someone else, hey bring me along, we'll see where it goes. I feel like you're just like I see where it goes kind of girly, yeah, like in the best, like I don't remember, if I read it or it's on podcast, but the word allow and it was just like allowing, things Like instead of hitting resistance all the time, just like allowing, and I feel like I'm on that vibe right now.
Speaker 1:Yeah, Allowing versus maybe like receiving Well always trying.
Speaker 2:That one was specific, like we're trying to do these things and that energy doesn't actually equate to something good at the end. So it's like allowing or being open to things happening or not happening leaves room for you to have good energy going into it.
Speaker 1:Oh, I like that. And it's like it removes a lot of that expectation. And I mean usually why you're upset is because you it's different than you expected or someone didn't meet your expectations. And it's like, well, one, can they or can that situation meet the expectations? And it's like people are always like I'm not going to lower it, I'm not going to do, I'm like, well, what if it's like you're saying, like it's more of an openness and allowing energy and you can decide once the thing comes like ah, actually I don't want that or yeah, I do.
Speaker 2:But instead of having that expectation or like leaning into the law of detachment and not being so attached to a certain outcome, I think it gives you more peace of mind.
Speaker 1:I think so, I agree. Okay. So, jehovah's Witness, did you all talk about money growing up so Like, what's the deal with that?
Speaker 2:I don't know that I tied money necessarily to that religion and I actually do, still to this day, kind of respect how they run things with money because you could do donations. They weren't in mega churches and I want to say they built the kingdom halls that they're in. The pastors or elders don't get paid, so they all have regular jobs. They're doing the work of the Lord Not to say that you can't be paid for that, I guess. But so I felt like how they ran that maybe was more healthy than I had seen in, you know, like mega Christian churches, which are quite scary to me because I'm also used to everybody standing up and singing together and so when I visit other churches and it's just like this rock band Do you remember those Christian CD commercials in like the 90s?
Speaker 2:That's what I feel like I'm in when I go to another church and I'm like it's a lot. It feels like the Truman Show a little bit. But yeah, a lot of them are cleaners and, like you know, worked normal jobs and had decent houses and cars and things. So I don't know that I thought about money so much in that correlation. My mom was a single parent, so it was very much like, yeah, we don't have money for that. Or I want to say that she didn't say that often and like we never went without anything.
Speaker 1:But yeah, money didn't feel like an attainable or easy thing to have, or maybe even like a focus Right, like it wasn't like a draw, yeah, or a motivator in like a like you're saying, like in an unhealthy way, like a greed, like those mega churches, there's a lot of greed, yeah, like a lot. Have you watched Righteous Gems Dance? Oh, it's really funny. It's on HBO.
Speaker 2:I'll have to check it out.
Speaker 1:It's Danny McBride who did like, oh my gosh, he's kind of like Will Ferrell, kind of vibe, and he's done some stuff with him. But it's like a satirical comedy about three siblings that run a mega church and it like is coming down from their dad. Like it's hilarious. There's a lot of famous people in it and I can't remember all their names.
Speaker 2:I'll have to go check it it sounds funny.
Speaker 1:It's very funny and like not at all what you would expect. You know, suspect, expect. It's kind of Not to raise your expectations, just allow, just allow. It, just allow. Well, I think it's super interesting because I just hadn't considered, like, the way that they think about money and the religion and everything, and I just feel it's just interesting and I love. I'm so curious and I just love to hear how people like felt about it or learned about it and I think I agree, like wanting for nothing. You know like, yeah, you have things you need, you even have some of the extras that you're talking about, that made you feel special and loved and you know, money doesn't.
Speaker 2:You don't have to have money present to have all those things. I don't feel like we talked about money as much when I was younger, but definitely when I got, you know, teenage and older, my mom was very like scared of everything all the time and so even when I went into entrepreneurship, which was kind of by accident, was like no, you need a job. Or when I went, even in high school, I got a scholarship, originally to go to a hair school and when I was like you can't do that, like you won't make any money, so I went to school for, I think, early childhood instead.
Speaker 1:Education. Yeah, do you think she thought that? Because you know it's such a job where, if you don't show up one day like you, don't get paid that day. Do you know what I mean?
Speaker 2:I mean, yeah, but I mean from being in it and also knowing how much I pay for my hair. Yeah, it's like it's a lucrative business.
Speaker 1:It is yeah, and I feel like even in a lot of like, like more recession kind of downturns in the economy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so I'm going to get my hair done. Yeah, I'm going to spend my last dollar to look cute.
Speaker 1:Exactly Like there's no, like there's not no, like no changes in it, but there's. I mean I get my nails done all the time and I wouldn't stop that, like I'd find the money.
Speaker 2:I think she's just so used. She was in the same job for 30 years and so had that like you want to get into a good job and stay there that kind of mentality, whereas everything else seems more unstable.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I will say like, even coming from, my grandma was a teacher and my mom she had multiple jobs growing up but then she became a pharmacist and she and my grandma would always tell me like that I scare them Like the uncertainty and the dealing with, like the ups and downs of it. I'm like you could literally go into work.
Speaker 2:I could go into work tomorrow and like they could just buy, like everything Everywhere is at will. I think, well, yeah it is At will termination so.
Speaker 1:Well, and like everywhere is at will, I think, well, yeah, it is termination so well. Like watching my parents, like there was other times where they restructured a company and the next day you don't have something like yeah to me. And I think I talked about this on another episode of the podcast, I think it was with um Jess Ambergy, where it's like is it really that stable? Right, she's the best. Is it really that stable to have nine to five?
Speaker 2:It's really just perspective. I love knowing, now that I'm in like my first job stint, that like if I do get fired or whatever happens that I know how to make money without someone employing me. Yeah, legally let's just put that disclaimer you can legally make money. I legally know how to make money without an employer?
Speaker 1:Yeah, because you've been in that situation. So let's talk a little bit about the entrepreneurship journey then, to give everybody some context. Like so you ended up going to esthetician school and I want to clarify like, is hair school esthetician school? Like they are different. They are different.
Speaker 2:Usually they're housed in like the same school. So there was an aesthetics program that was fairly new. I think I was like in the third class and it was inside of the cosmetology school. But they are separate licenses. Although some cosmetologists can do like there's a little bit of overlap, like makeup, I want to say maybe they can do face waxing too. Yeah, but yeah so yeah.
Speaker 2:So aesthetics is full body waxing, makeup and skincare. And yeah, it was actually the year my mom got cancer. I think that's when she kind of started to realize like, oh, we can't control everything. So she's like do whatever makes you happy. And I was like, okay, I'm going to go do this. So her perspective shifted.
Speaker 1:And how is her oh, she's in remission. Amazing, yeah, it's been 12 years. Sorry, I didn't know how to phrase the question quick enough. She's alive.
Speaker 2:She's here. She's here. She's a little grumpy, but she's always a little grumpy, but she's yeah alive and in remission. And yeah, during that time it was, I mean she would still send me like job postings, like she wasn't completely like.
Speaker 1:I mean it's interesting because she could have gone the direction more of like get a job because I want to know that you're taken care of, you know, and it's almost that concept like you're saying of like I want to know that you're you're taken care of in the fact that you're doing things that you want to be doing. You know, and do you think, like for her job for 30 years, was she happy in that career?
Speaker 2:I think there was a lot of instances that which I see now that I'm in an office setting of where she got looked over and like things were changing, but not, you know, technically in her favor and so I think she was happy for the most part. But it's also like what she knew right.
Speaker 1:So she tells you she has cancer. Was it breast cancer?
Speaker 2:yeah, it was my grandma had passed from it, so it's definitely something that we had been looking for. Now I, you know, get mammograms super early and hopefully I don't know. I'm like I know there's tests which I have, like the BRCA gene test. Yeah, my aunt got it done, but it seems to be the oldest girl currently in these past two generations which I'm the oldest girl.
Speaker 1:I'm going to take you to get that test I got biopsied when I got my breast reduction, and so I think all is well. Okay, Well, that's been a minute. I feel like we should go get another mammogram. Well, yeah, it's been a year.
Speaker 2:The healthcare system let's not even get started on that.
Speaker 1:True true, true, but you know it's interesting because, like so many people I know have at 35, which I did feel like it was like 40 before or something I like are speaking about mammograms and like it's really important. So it's just interesting little tangent for us but like go get your mammograms, y'all. Yeah, check those babies, check them out. It's good to know what's going on, especially with like just I mean, the world changes all the time. Like you're saying, it probably takes a long time to get an appointment. Just like, yeah, everything gives us cancer at this point, everything I bet this water I'm drinking.
Speaker 1:There's something in there, the plastic, this can, whatever it is. So, anyways, you decided to.
Speaker 2:So I decided to go into aesthetics mainly because I wanted to see the world and I didn't know how to do that, like, like I said, I've been raised by a single parent, you know we didn't have much extra and I was wanting to like travel, like I want to get out of here. So I started kind of looking up jobs that you could do that with. And actually I was with my friend Jamika and we were looking at stuff on the internet and cruise ships came up, oh yeah. And so I was like how can I like get to work on here and not have to do all the things, maybe just one thing? And then somehow we came across aesthetics and then there was a program in Evansville and so I'm like, okay, like I'm going to do it.
Speaker 1:So did you ever end up on a cruise ship?
Speaker 2:I know, the more I started researching, I'm like, oh no.
Speaker 1:You'd be on there like nine months or something.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so your first contract is usually a year, like they usually don't do less than that for you, which may have changed. Just mind you, it was 12 years ago, um, and I had never lived away from home, so I'm like that's like, that's asking a lot. I would, I feel like I would break the contract and not talk to people. Yeah, as you know, I'm fairly chatty. Yeah, if there's new people around like I would be in trouble all the time. Like I've met these friends on this stop Like, yeah, just come on the ship until the next stop. I like I would just I think we get in trouble for the wildest things and also they work them way too hard, like the amount of people they have to take a day.
Speaker 2:By the end of my career, I was taking maybe four people a day. Max prior was six and I think they just stack them all day long and I just, yeah, don't want to work that hard. Yeah, that's so. I was like I'll just work and make money to go on a cruise. But then I started to discover, like learning more about the ocean and like 80% of it is undiscovered. Yeah, and that just I was like I don't want to be in the middle of the ocean and Mama Earth gets mad. So all that to say no, I've never ended up on a cruise ship.
Speaker 1:I told her at lunch. I was like over those breadsticks. I was like I think you'd like it, but I don't know. I mean there's a lot of negatives too, but there's a lot of positives, but anyhow, I love crozzles, so it's fine. But I love to sit on the balcony away from all the people and just like look at the water and feel like my problems are really small and this is great and I love water.
Speaker 2:Like I live on the river and like I've gone on a catamaran, I will say in Italy, which sounds so obnoxious, but that was great. But to be on a big ship, I understand buoyancy, but I also don't Because why is this on top of the water and can it stay here? Actually?
Speaker 1:So maybe let's get a naval course. I don't know the words, but like yeah, I'm like curious too, anyways. So where have you traveled to, though? Like have you been able to get around a little bit? Yeah?
Speaker 2:I've been very fortunate to. You know. I think the first time I left the country yeah, I got my passport for a wedding. I was hired for a wedding in Jamaica, and that just kind of just blew my mind open. I'm like, oh my God, not only am I going, but I'm being hired to be there, which was great. So Jamaica, and then a lot of Mexico, thailand and Italy and Paris, and wow.
Speaker 1:I mean it's been a while since I've traveled, so yeah, has it been mostly through like working opportunities, or a few of them are work lots of.
Speaker 2:I mean you get leisure with time too, ish yeah yeah Ish, you learn very quickly like you're kind of always on the clock when someone hires you to come out of the country with them.
Speaker 1:They're like sure, I'll do your hair, you know makeup. Or like, yeah, you need a touch up. Yeah.
Speaker 2:And then one time we were doing sunset shoots, like sunset and sunrise, and so my call times were before sunrise and right. So like the schedules just get kind of tight. So it's like, yes, I'm here and it's great, but you also don't get like a lot of leeway to do whatever you want.
Speaker 1:so how do you find a job like that, like where do you? You just google.
Speaker 2:I wish. I think any job that I've ever gotten is through networking and so just someone knowing me, or that photographer in particular. We'd worked together for years and so I just built up a relationship and a rapport, which was so funny. I didn't expect to go when she announced that she's getting married and they were going there, and I think like she went and got a trial there and she came back and she was like, are you a bit? I'm like, yeah, I could be a bit. I mean, let me check my calendar. No, yes, I'm coming.
Speaker 1:I want to go. So, like I was thinking you networked and found like a photographer who had maybe suggested you for like destination weddings, but you're saying the photographer that you worked with a lot was getting married themselves.
Speaker 2:Yes, and then she was yeah, she lives I think she still lives in Evansville, but yeah, we were working together. She hired me for that and then she also did like an excursion in Italy, in Paris, and I went along for that. So amazing, I love you know connections. Yeah, we I, we started our businesses pretty much kind of around that same time, so it was nice to like grow and get to do so many random things together.
Speaker 1:So when you started your esthetician career, like, did you go into any other spaces and work, or did you like start your own space immediately? Like how did that work?
Speaker 2:So I actually worked for a spa, maybe about a year before I went on my own a year and then I worked at a hair salon, actually built on a room for me, which was crazy, and I worked there for a little bit and it just was hair salon culture. It's just way different. And I was like, ah, and it was a farmer's market or something that I went to, that I met Mary Allen, who is a dear friend after all these years, and she ended up having a vacant space that I think a massage therapist was in prior to. So, yeah, then I started renting a space from her and that relationship blossomed. We have a skincare line together still to this day.
Speaker 2:She's now a city councilwoman. I actually lived with her and her husband, who now I consider my dad because he just does all the dad things for me, for maybe a year or two, maybe three years actually, and so, yeah, that relationship just like evolved. But I started off, you know, thinking like let me get some experience under my belt and then I just wanted a different experience for my clients and I'm like I don't think I can do this in these spaces.
Speaker 1:And then you branched out on your own and got your own studio space when, like I'm assuming, all of this is in Evansville.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it was downtown in Haney's Corner, which it was a great time to be down Because, like, hardly anything was down there then, and so I got to be a part of seeing Haney's Corner grow Like every business that came, like it's vibrant and popping now, and I lived downtown at the time and, yeah, to be immersed in the culture to where I could like walk from my apartment to work and, like you knew everybody in the corner. I really enjoyed that.
Speaker 1:I don't think I told you my brother lives there, no, in Evansville. You never said that. I don't think, yeah, for the amount of times you've said Evansville to me. I think it's because he lived one time in Owensboro and, like I, keep getting him confused.
Speaker 2:Owensboro's like 45 minutes away.
Speaker 1:It's also Kentucky is Indiana. Yeah, like north East West, I'm not the person to ask for that. Yeah, it's one highway, it's 64. It's past Santa Claus, so then it's it is. Didn't you go to Santa Claus, indiana the other day?
Speaker 2:I did. My orthodontist has a place there and in Evansville, and they weren't in when I was in Evansville, so then I had to go to Santa Claus the next day. It was a whole thing.
Speaker 1:I think for people that aren't from like the Midwest, like what is Santa Claus? Santa Claus Indiana has holiday world and every little part of the park is a different holiday.
Speaker 2:But also outside of the park there is Christmas themed everything, and so Jake is from there, no way, and so I've been a couple of times, but more like out in the country, yeah, but it's just like such a weird place. Yeah, it's weird that people live there Right or are from there Like how are you from Santa Claus Indiana?
Speaker 1:No, for some reason I can't imagine it either, but it's fun to go yeah.
Speaker 2:That's how I feel about New Harmony, indiana. If you've never been, never been there. I never stay when it gets dark because I just think the corn people are going to come out. Too much cornfields, yeah, and I'm like nobody is from here, it's just a place to have weddings, but I guess some people do live there.
Speaker 1:I mean, somebody lives most places.
Speaker 2:I mean, yeah, I guess you have to live there to work there so much.
Speaker 1:Gotta go to the local Olive Garden. There's no Olive Garden there.
Speaker 2:I don't think there's any franchises there, not big enough.
Speaker 1:Maybe there's a subway. Well, yeah, there's got to be a subway. So I drive across the country with my mom, like why I?
Speaker 2:don't know. I did that once with almost a complete stranger, really. I met her like once and she put on Facebook that she needed to be in LA by this day or something. And I was like, oh, like I need to be in LA. At that time too, I had already bought a plane ticket, so I was like a road trip sounds so much fun. The amount of times I could have been murdered.
Speaker 1:I was just thinking like oh my gosh, it was just like vibes.
Speaker 2:It thinking like, oh my gosh, it was just like vibes, it feels like good vibes, and it was like you said. Yeah, we stopped in New Mexico and Lincoln, nebraska, and yeah, like, and she drove most of the way, it was great and then. I used my. I always fly southwest, not always because they don't do international, but domestically I prefer southwest. So I moved my flight to see my friend in Seattle to fly out of there. So it all worked out. Yeah, I'm alive to tell the story.
Speaker 1:I'm very happy because it could have gone every way, but I just listened to a lot of true crimes so I could never.
Speaker 2:My brain is too fragile for that.
Speaker 1:It makes me feel safe for some reason, like I just feel, like I know how someone can kill you. Yeah, like my heart or not my heart, I feel like this warranted a button of some sort. Oh, I forgot you guys. I have so many buttons. They have been experiencing my buttons. That sounds weird. True crime, that's my favorite one.
Speaker 2:True crime. Listen, that was crazy.
Speaker 1:What even was that? That's what you sound like on a true crime documentary.
Speaker 2:That's what I was going to say that felt on brand. I drove across the country to LA.
Speaker 1:Listen, I had to go to LA, too, for no other reason than I wanted to, and I went into a fabric shop when I had the new black and, like I wanted to go find, did this have like special fabric? Yeah, okay. Well, la has a garment district. Oh, that sounds fun. There's not that many of them in the country. I mean, there, la has a garment district. Oh, that sounds fun. There's not that many of them in the country. I mean, there's one in New York. I had been to that one and I wanted to go to LA. But I also like the year before that I had gone to Orlando for a month and just took the month to like it was in 2021. So I just like mostly slept most of the time and tried to like process 2020 by myself, without like I mean, I had pets at the time and I mean I was in a great relationship. What happened to them? They passed, unfortunately.
Speaker 2:So you had pets at the time.
Speaker 1:Well, like I just wanted to go somewhere where I wasn't concerned about literally anything other than myself. Yeah, and that was just how I was going to like deal with. You know, being an entrepreneur during that time was really stressful, and just all of that. So at that time I had told myself, like, okay, well, maybe next year I'll go somewhere else. So I decided to go out to LA and my family had like already planned some kind of cruise outside like that left from LA. So I was like, oh well, mom, you're already going. Like why don't you just drive with me, so that I don't like die in the middle of nowhere? And it was a really cool drive. So we stopped in Arizona as well. Oh yeah, Blackstaff, Arizona. Oh no, I'm at— New Mexico, yeah, we stopped in Corrales.
Speaker 2:It was beautiful.
Speaker 1:Everywhere out there in the West and we got like a hippie.
Speaker 2:We stayed in this Airbnb with this hippie couple. Yeah, and it was the best because we talked about essential, like just all the woo-woo stuff, and I was like this is. I think they even made us breakfast.
Speaker 1:Really yeah.
Speaker 2:You're like I was a Jehovah's Witness and now I'm. I tend to leave that out on most things. It very seldom gets brought up at this point, but some things trigger me to be like, oh yeah, la was probably prior to, I'd say, like my first big trip not the ones outside of the country, but I was actually burnt out. Maybe I've been like three or five years in and I hadn't taken any breaks and I took a month off yeah, see, to go see my friend in Seattle. I can't remember where else I went, but Seattle was the focus and I just wanted to see him and he was so happy and I was just like, ah, I love this so much. And I came back like rejuvenated, because I had also started a magazine by that time. Oh my gosh, yeah, this is coming back.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I started in a magazine for four years, wow, and I had an incredible, I would say, team. I didn't hire any employees, but the work we did with just was it about four contractors? In comparison to these companies, I have 20 people. I'm still very proud of the work that we accomplished and our whole thing was, you know, bringing community together. So every quarter we'd have a launch party, and that was the only time that you could get the printed version is if you came to the launch party. Yeah, wait, what was it?
Speaker 1:called again. Love it, evv.
Speaker 2:I wish I wouldn't have picked such Evansville-focused names for things.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel like I remember hearing about this and you said quarterly right, mm-hmm. Yeah, because I was like, yeah, you seem to me like you'd kill it at a magazine.
Speaker 2:I did enjoy it but towards the end it was like like I hated always. Like with the holistic facials and just self-care, it's very much about being present, right, and with the magazine it was so much about planning for the future, like always thinking a quarter ahead minimum, and so those just kept kind of clashing because then I just couldn't like sit and ground and be in the moment because it's like, oh, we need to take pictures of freaking summer stuff and it's winter, you know. It just felt started to get like incongruent.
Speaker 1:So you're in your own space in Evansville.
Speaker 2:You got those magazines, oh, and prior to that, I started a Tuesday Talks with Kena which I just think of some of these names. Sometimes I'm like I was so audacious, you know, like I really did not care, I just wanted to do things and I did them. Yeah, and I kind of miss being so out there. Yeah, I feel way more reserved. But Tuesday Talks with Kena, I just wanted women to gather and like I just wanted to create spaces for connection, like real connection, because I didn't have that even when I was growing up. It was like we're in the church every Monday, monday, wednesday, thursday, saturday. We were out in full service Sunday, you know, like life revolved around church but it didn't feel like community Got it, and so I think I really craved that when I got older.
Speaker 1:I think when I like learn about somebody or and like I don't know, like I said to you before we started recording, I was like man, megan Jordan, and I just always talked about you and like your space and all this stuff, and I think she's the one who told me about the magazine or something, because I don't believe I heard it directly from you before, but like there was just something about where she was, just like Kane is cool, and I just always had the energy around you being so positive.
Speaker 1:And I think when I just saw you like sometimes you can just see somebody or how they interact with something or whatever and I think, probably even since, like when we did start to know each other when you were at the New Black for like Galentine's Day and stuff like just I think I can just see a heart really fast. Like I can see like genuine people and like and what I mean by that is people looking for connection. So, in the same way that I want to be very genuine and like I want to create a true, like genuine connection, that's what I mean and I think my heart has always been like Kana's one she's there.
Speaker 2:I think I am definitely a pendulum swinger to where I can be very open and then something happens to where I close. And so it's been a constant work to be open but have some discernment and, you know, still leave everything open for connection, but be okay if that doesn't happen.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's true. It's like it's hard for me when it doesn't happen. Yeah.
Speaker 2:Then I'm like well, what was today, even for? And then I don't want to try to create connection just to be liked or to know a person. And I think that very much can happen when you're always open to connection. Then it's like, oh, trying to manage all these people and all the things. So it's kind of like learning to pull back and like again, allowing the connection if it happens and allowing if it doesn't happen.
Speaker 1:I heard some quote recently that was like you don't get to choose, and it's not exactly what we're talking about, but it's close is like you don't get to choose joy, you get to see joy and allow yourself to experience it. Like you get to allow yourself into these situations that are positive, or and I might've really fucked up that quote, but the concept around it.
Speaker 2:You made a new one.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there you go. Everything's quotable on this podcast. But it's like we don't always get to pick when something is around us. But we get to pick if we engage with it in a way that you know can affect us positively or negatively. And it's like, yeah, all we can really do is control, like how we handle something or react to something or respond or manage it or whatever.
Speaker 1:And a lot of times I'll find myself where I'm like, oh, I really put myself out there and I was like looking for this connection and it was because I was like searching so hard for it that it didn't happen. So it's like that forced. You know, I was like forcing things and if you can be like, okay, well, I'm going to be ready for if it comes, and then allow it when it does like feel so good. So when you had your business and you kind of started thinking like, oh, I want to bring in, I want to scale, because everybody loves to tell you when you have a business, scale, franchise, do more, do everything, oh my God. And then you end up being like, okay, but what about? Like when I enjoyed just having my business, be me and my clients, and like it's so nice sometimes, and I think people always want something more than that, but aren't either realizing how much different it really is than being a solopreneur On the back end.
Speaker 1:Or like just really ready for it, timing wise, money wise, any of that and it's hard because everything can turn on a dime, as, like we said. Like I mean, it's just crazy out here. What are we going to do? So it's kind of interesting to like think of all those times, you know, and when I had the new black, I felt that way, like I had to double every year and had, you know, so many employees at one time and we were in the mall so we were open every single day and I was just like I am so depressed. This is not what I got into this for, and I know you have some like similar vibes around that. So I'm kind of wondering if you'll share that with our listeners, our girlies.
Speaker 2:I actually never sought to expand. I was pretty happy in my situation. I left for about a year to come here to Louisville. What seven years.
Speaker 1:I know I was trying to figure it out Seven years ago, pre-pandemic. That's all I can remember.
Speaker 2:I loved my little space because I could come and go as I pleased. I didn't need to like hurt myself to make money to cover the rent or any of that. But there was a person who kept over the years like contacting me to see if I was taking on another person and the last time that happened I had started dating. I'm like I already said Jake's name. I'm like I'm like, do I keep his name a secret? He doesn't care. I started dating Jake and I keep his name a secret, he doesn't care. I started dating Jake and I was just like very happy and open and I'm like, well, I've let this person you know in my life, maybe it's time to like allow for expansion, for more. So they came on as kind of like a contractor to where they were offering services in my space and I was the clients that I couldn't get in, because by this time I've had a pretty steady book I would offset to them.
Speaker 1:And that was in Louisville.
Speaker 2:In Evansville, in Evansville, got it. I came. I went back to Evansville after about a year here because I just kept thinking like oh my God, yeah, to that point where I was exhausted trying to do both, because my brides typically book a year or more out. So even though I'd left, I still had bridal contracts. So I would work here, leave usually Wednesday or Thursday to go to Evansville to service clients until I had that wedding and then after the wedding on Saturday I would turn around and come to Louisville, got it.
Speaker 2:So about three months of that, yeah, at first I was like this is great, like I get to bounce around and do all this stuff. But by the third or fourth month I was like this is too much, and so I had to like have a real conversation of like is this feasible? And then you know kind of have the download of you either have to close and move completely or you need to go back and like finish what you started. So I decided to finish what I started and I went back to like you know full time and all of that. And it was good, you know, for a while, adding that person definitely made me tighten up my own processes for things. Right, it does. Because then you're looking at everything as if like oh, I need to pass this information on, like, what's the best way to do that, even for myself, like what's my brand voice or all these things that you've been doing that you may not have on paper already. And then it's like OK, I need to systemize that. So for that reason, it was really great.
Speaker 2:Of course, more people being served. I was specifically plant based, so they also had to be in the space. So more people getting plant based services made me very happy. And then, yeah, that bug of like OK, we have one person and the room was really set up for one person, so she was working on the days that I didn't work. And then it's like okay, well, now it's time to expand so that you know everybody has a room. And so I did finally find another place.
Speaker 2:But that landlord oh my God, oh my God. I had so many issues with her. I loved that space. I lived upstairs in that space for a little bit. It was so hectic because I also moved in the week. I was leaving for Italy, and so it was just so much. It's a lot. Yeah, and my previous landlord was amazing. He was great. We're still friends to this day. But yeah, she just, I have like mild trauma from that and I don't. I had looked at it several times but I did not realize a dog place was next door until I got in there and I'm like, oh my God, these dogs are barking like every day All the time. Yeah, I mean nothing. Some sound machines and stuff can't fix, but there's just those little things where it's just like ah, but we moved into that space.
Speaker 2:That was all gravy and fine, and we added another person, several other people I had contractors throughout that would like rent the space for a short sense of time. And then we added another full-time person in 2020.
Speaker 1:And so that was all fine Like beginning of 2020?
Speaker 2:Yeah, or maybe it was after. We could open up again, right, right, and I didn't get any money during COVID. I don't know how everybody else did.
Speaker 1:Same money during COVID. I don't know how everybody else did Same, but we were still fine. We were still exceeding money. And then, yeah, entrepreneurs were not like given the $600 a week.
Speaker 2:Oh my God, I'm still ate up about that. I know right, it's like rude. I'm shopping online. I'm like with what money? But we pivoted. I was starting to sell products and having pickups.
Speaker 1:I have that word. Sorry, my brain Pivot.
Speaker 2:Yeah, but yeah, it's important. And then we expanded even more and everybody was so excited I went from I think we had 900 square feet in that last space up and then we moved into 3,000 square feet oh, that's a big jump, yeah, a big jump.
Speaker 2:That mathematically I did not plan for. And so it's kind of like when you have the seed that you've planted and it's grown and you're watching it be beautiful, and then it like it grows too massive and then there's weeds and that's kind of what it feels like. So externally, all of this looks great to everyone. They're like oh my gosh, the expansion, more people, blah, blah, blah. But you know, on the back end it's like how am I going to sustain this? And sustaining came from me working more hours, which doesn't make for a happy me. I'm just not made for working a lot. I mean, I don't think anybody's made for like working, but I just don't have the fortitude for it. I'm a three day a week, mentally Like I can only be there three days a week.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm more like a couple hours every day, but like it's like a couple hours and day, but like I'm it's like a couple hours and I just push myself the rest of the time.
Speaker 2:But I'm just like I don't want to always be in that mode. I don't, and so, and not even just like the modes with my clients. It's like now I have all this paperwork and like keeping up with if something's wrong then I have to, you know, get whatever they're saying and get it to the landlord. And there was just like so many other things that came with it and I did not charge enough. And I'm like the queen of telling other entrepreneurs to charge more.
Speaker 2:I am like what Charge more? But for whatever reason, I was like I just want this to be a space for everybody, so I was trying to make pricing, you know, more inclusive, but then of course, on the back end, that was draining me and so, yeah, expansion, and that's so frustrating because it comes from such a positive place.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's like I just want everybody to be here and when people do see you doing well, they expect you to pay it forward as well. And I'm like, yeah, that's great, but like, are you telling all the dudes this too? Because, like, I feel like it's really been put upon women to take care of everyone, to care, yeah, to tend to and to make space and like as much as like I think that it can feel great to do that and it can even be in our nature to do that, like I want to do that, and it can even be in our nature to do that, like I want to do that. All the time it isn't treated the same, I think a lot, and it's almost expected to a point of, yeah, like martyr, yeah, and it's like I wish I would have thought through more Again.
Speaker 2:you kind of it grew past me and so I didn't have the foresight to say, like, is this what I really want? Like, am I doing this because it looks good on paper or because this was my mission? And you know, my mission was to create space for women and it didn't have to manifest as a collective, it could have just stayed small. But because I was so heavily influenced by the people around me and wanting to help more and not knowing that I needed to do that from a place where I was so heavily influenced by the people around me and wanting to help more and not knowing that I needed to do that from a place where I was okay first. Definitely.
Speaker 2:I know I'm like, I'm listening, I'm just like, yeah, every few years I'm like, and so I think it's okay to be selfish and I know that word can be triggering for some people, but I think of it in a way where it's like the moments that I've been selfish in my career or in my personal life have greatly benefited the people who are around me, because when I'm doing things that are in alignment for me, I'm meeting people I need to meet, I'm doing the things I need to do. When I'm not in an alignment, it's just a shit show.
Speaker 1:Yeah, like, I feel like when you think of it, like this garden, like you, in order to keep it beautiful and and growing, but at like a manageable pace. Yeah, you gotta like get it out, get the weeds out, like you were saying, and and I, I mean we so often say like fill your own cup first or put on your own oxygen mask or whatever. And I still struggle with that like over and over.
Speaker 2:And it's just, it feels very I think, because we don't see enough people actually doing it. So it's like we'll say it and people are like okay, I'm going to go get a pedicure, I'm going to go get a small treatment per se. Which keep getting your small treatments.
Speaker 1:That's what says the previous.
Speaker 2:Those things are necessary. But it's not like go look at your financial statement, your profit and loss, and then tell me this is a good idea, Right, the whole self-care of it.
Speaker 1:Because you freaking, can't.
Speaker 2:And so I think, yeah, self-care or filling your cup or putting your oxygen mask on first isn't being portrayed in a way that's like actually sometimes that's looking at your numbers and saying does this make actual sense?
Speaker 1:Right or asking for help. Yeah, I was so bad about that. It's so hard. That's very first daughter of us. Yeah, I mean, I'm only daughter.
Speaker 2:I feel like I'm generally good about it, but there was just something, when it came to business specifically, that I just couldn't.
Speaker 1:Well, and it's interesting because you're right Like I think of you as the person that is saying that all the time and is about that, and I am also the person that is saying that all the time and talking to people. But it's not often that people say it to me, you know, and I'm like it's either that where I will be priced way too high or way too low for someone, and I'm just like, okay, well, I have to find my people that it's the perfect price for whatever. And if I don't have like enough coming in, like then I can't do everything that I want to do for the community and can't hold the space. And you know, there's stuff that you'll start that like you're saying these expansions and moving into these spaces, like that, you're like this is absolutely the right move, like no doubt, that you're like this is absolutely the right move, like no doubt.
Speaker 2:And then like five minutes later.
Speaker 1:We should talk about that a little bit.
Speaker 2:Where learning my human design oh yeah, I got very into human design, I think around COVID and knowing that I have an emotional authority, learning that and learning that I'm also a manifesting generator was such a big thing for me. It's like, you know, people are always niche it down or like I think now people are okay, more so. Well, they're passionate yes, like I know everyone is. But prior before, it was like you need to pick one thing and just be really great at it. But it was like, as you can see, it's like the magazine and I, you know, did several other things.
Speaker 2:It's like, oh, I need to stop doing other things and focus on this one thing, but I'm learning that I'm a manifesting generator. It's like my energy is meant to do a lot of different things, or I do need to sit and wait until I feel neutral about this decision before I make it my emotional authority. Those things really help, you know, when I keep it top of mind to. Those things really help, you know, when I keep it top of mind to do, because sometimes I'm just like, yeah, let's do it, let's go, and then it's like, yeah, the five minutes later it's like oh, I don't actually want to do that.
Speaker 1:I know I need to like set a clock when somebody tells me like a new idea, before I say anything.
Speaker 2:We need to do that.
Speaker 1:We need to do that. We need to start being like okay, this sounds amazing, I will get back to you next week about it. Yeah, I'm going to just adopt that exact phrase. Great, let's chat next week when I've had some time to think through it.
Speaker 2:Because I'm such a like I want to get this done yesterday and then let them come back to you, because sometimes you can put so much energy into it.
Speaker 1:And then it's that whole like you know the letdown or whatever, and you're like, well, I thought we were on the same page with it, but I do think mine was manifesting generator as well. I need to like look back at it, because I was looking at it like during COVID so just been a minute but like to go back to that and like, yeah, we were talking about this over the breadstick. It was like we got to really chill. Because that's where I keep getting myself. Personally. I'm like, okay, I'm getting myself in trouble because I'm just I said yes to things that then I regret because I didn't have enough time to think through them, or I agreed to something just when I wasn't really ready, or didn't get to check my schedule or whatever, and didn't think about, didn't think about my cycle, you know. At the same time, I'm like, oh, I'm going to be Anything happening that week.
Speaker 2:I don't want to be a part of actually, yeah.
Speaker 1:I'm just like I have like two weeks on and then two weeks off and the things I say yes to on the weeks on I'm dumb. On the weeks off I'm like dude. I just want to sit and play Sims and like and like learning.
Speaker 2:I will say like my last relationship really taught me about downtime, because prior to I would you know, work on clients, go home, work on my website, and then the next new idea, or I would be out networking like everything surrounded business. And then when I got with him, it was just like, oh, I can like have dinner and sit and watch tv show. Right, I didn even go to bed today because who's answering emails right now? Like I could just do it tomorrow, which maybe I've gotten a little too carried away with that at this point.
Speaker 1:But yeah, it's all harmony. How do we find the flow of it Exactly? And it's just like, like I like to send invoices when I'm on my period because I'm like I am sending out this money, I, I am sending out this money. That does work. Like I don't feel the emotional attachment to the like business side like as much as I do when I'm like in the on stage, because I'm so overly energetic and positive in that time. I'm like, oh shit, like, oh, I love them. I don't, I don't want, they don't need this invoice. And then when I get on my period, I'm just like, like grumpy and it's just just send it out that way or whatever. So I even, like I've been trying to like think through that a little bit more and try to see like what are the weeks I need to be taking, like the meetings, versus when do I send out the information?
Speaker 2:And I've tried to be good about that, and when I had my own business, it was so much easier to say like these are the days I'm not working Because again it's like that's quote unquote, selfish aspect but you don't want me when I'm grumpy, yeah, you know paid a hundred dollars to be here and you don't want me to show up grumpy, yeah, so it's like I'm just going to take the day off.
Speaker 1:You just put like eye mask on them, then be like and this is your soothing eye mask.
Speaker 2:And then you're like so I'm like scrubbing their face extra, yeah, and it's just like I think my spaces have always been very like energetic and that's like the one thing I hear when people walk in or when they leave. It's just like just feels so good in here, the way it feels, and it's like I'm very intentional about my energy and my spa spaces and so, keeping that in mind, it's like I'm very intentional about my energy and my spa spaces and so, keeping that in mind, it's like, yeah, I don't want to come here when I'm not feeling optimal, if I can avoid it Right, right, and of course sometimes you can't, but then of course there's times when you can, yeah, and like I have this like gratitude journal.
Speaker 1:I like work through a lot and I'm like man flexibility is like is such a high priority for me. I mean just being diabetic as well, like my energy being consistent is ever changing and it's so difficult. So, like she was, even Kana was watching me eat before I was like I'm not going to make it through.
Speaker 2:I actually missed most of it. I just saw you be like. I said no tomatoes and there's a tomato there's. So why did they put?
Speaker 1:tomatoes on.
Speaker 2:I like. I didn't used to like them. I will say the old way I get no cooked tomatoes just not raw. That's gross. A raw tomato is much better than a cooked tomato.
Speaker 1:Really, yeah, all right, well, we'll have this fight later. So what happened with you? Know, we've been saying former esthetician, former business owner, Tell us about that, because I mean, I've closed four businesses as well, which is so crazy. You just move on from stuff you know, but how are you like, how did that all happen? I?
Speaker 2:think I got a breast reduction and that kind of. You know, people don't talk about the spiritual aspect of surgeries, but it kind of just like cracked me open to where. It was just like, okay, I could have died during this, which sounds dramatic. But also the things they have you fill out and what they're saying to you before you get surgery, it's just like wow, like a lot. I wish you would have said this like a week ago, cause I maybe wouldn't have done it. But now I'm here. Um, so I had a surgery and you know I have amazing friends and Jake helped take care of me while I was recouping.
Speaker 2:But just still knowing that so many things in my business weren't the way that I wanted them to be was really hard to come to terms with. It's like here's what I started with and here's what I have now. And it's like how do I get back to feeling joy? I mean, I created the space for myself, kind of, and for my clients, and now it's for everybody else and everybody's doing what they want inside of something I created. So once I got kind of to that stage, it was like, okay, we're not on the same page anymore and here's the page I want to be on, and so the people in the space at that time didn't want to be on the new page, which is totally fine, because I had come to peace with I don't want to keep martyring myself or, like, keep going in a direction that I know is not the direction that I want to go.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so that was all kosher, not quite. But during that time I was trying to figure out OK, these people are leaving, what am I? Am I going to do this all over again? And I just basically opted not to do it all over again and I needed a break. My engagement at that time was ending as well, and so it's just like a bunch of heartache at one time and and it's been a year now and so I still feel like it was the best. I honestly wish I would have pivoted or closed prior to that, because the math was not mathing for a while.
Speaker 1:For a while it takes a while to really come to that realization, sometimes because you just have so much hope, hopeful, yeah, and it's like, and it's done it before, so why wouldn't it pop right back? You know?
Speaker 2:And so I just yeah, I got to the point where it's like I even I had a funeral for the business.
Speaker 1:Wow, yeah, my friends, I kind of love that it was I, because you have to grieve everything.
Speaker 2:Like you really don't think of it like friendships.
Speaker 1:You have to grieve situations Like I don't know, like it's interesting, it doesn't have to be sad for a long time, but you do have to like acknowledge.
Speaker 2:That it's happening, it's happening and that was the thing. It was kind of like I tried to put the blind. I worked for a life coach for I don't know 10 years or doing. She's one of my clients. I did her makeup and she had a funeral for excuses during one of her. She had like a series and so I was like I should do this for the beauty room, and yeah, it was great.
Speaker 2:It's what I needed. I just had a great night with friends. We all dressed in black. My best friend gave a eulogy for the business. That was really cute. I should ask her to send that to me so I can frame it. I love that and, yeah, it was very neat. It was bittersweet, but it was like we were closing the space and I just wanted to have some closure there. Yeah, because even in each space that I move into, I do like a little opening ceremony where I invite my clients and friends and we have a tarot reader and she goes and stages the space.
Speaker 1:Because it gets the energy right.
Speaker 2:And so I'm like how fitting, During the period of knowing I was probably going to close, I had already given, sent letters and said, okay, you guys aren't signing 90 days, which is very generous, so generous. I'm trying to figure out what I want to do next. So I start visiting Louisville again because it's always been my like place to get away and I think I met Monica, like on Instagram, and she has a spiritual shop called the Bodhi Tree out in Norton Commons and went for a visit and she's like you can pop up here and do facials anytime you want. Oh, oh, that's nice, I know. I was like great.
Speaker 2:So we did a pop-up even before I moved, which was fun and kind of was like by the time we close, I'm like I guess I'm just going to go live in Louisville. I ended up finding a place in Jeff, which I really love. I saw the picture online and it's on the river and I was like I'm going to go heal here and even sometimes I think about I'm like this is so crazy, that like I saw that and I was like I want it to be mine, and now I'm there.
Speaker 1:The water can be, so healing it is, you know, I mean, I even take a different way to work so that I can view the river, the same river, because I live in the same town as you, right across the river from Louisville. But like anytime, it's like sunny I go over this little hill and it just comes down and all like the water glistens, yes, and gives me these little glimmers of just joy.
Speaker 2:I love it. I walk that bridge so much Like. It's given me so much solace. But once I got here I cried for I don't know a month or two. I still cry sometimes, but it was a lot to just face reality.
Speaker 2:you know, because you have in your head all these dreams and these visions of what you think life is going to be like, that, you know forcing. And then, when it doesn't happen, you're just like, what do I do now? And I had planned my life out for like 10 years and I had just gotten to the mark where it's like, oh, everything on my vision board has come true. Like I have all these things that I wanted on paper. But I think what we forget is that the person that gets to that point is a different person, and so some of the things that I thought I wanted, you know I didn't want anymore and it was hard to like be honest with myself and say I don't want that You're right.
Speaker 1:That's the hardest part is like it comes along with so much stuff, you know. It comes along with things and feelings and thoughts and judgments about yourself. And I mean, for me in therapy, that's what I'm learning is like to remove the judgment of myself in any situation, basically. But yeah, you're saying so, your engagement had ended and you're moved here. Your business had closed. What? What did you do next? Did you keep doing the?
Speaker 1:She's shaking her head. I took a little bit of everything, a little bit of nothing. Yeah, my friends came down. I'm like really proud of you for taking that. Like that really is, like I think it should be self most. You know, like I think self-ish, like ish a little bit sometimes and I mean that's difficult because it's difficult in practice for me, but like at the end of the day, like yeah, you have to go to bed with yourself and like what are the thoughts? Did you make yourself proud today? Do you feel good about these things? And every night, when you kind of go to bed, oh shit, like I don't today, like it adds up, I'm like you're the only one that lives your whole life, yeah, and I mean that's, I think when you're an entrepreneur, you get so much feedback from your environment around you and sometimes it's necessary for you to continue to take that feedback.
Speaker 2:So it's like if my clients say, oh, we want more massage during our facial, or like, you know that feedback, you're like, okay, let me pivot to make sure they're taken care of. But then that feeds into someone you know people being like oh, you should have a bigger space, you should have more people, you should be growing, and that can seep into like what your vision is for yourself. And, like you said, like you are the only person that is going to bed or paying those bills, or you know, yeah, you're the only one who can see that bank account.
Speaker 2:You're the only one, and so getting comfortable with not performing is what. Like. During that time of rest, it was like, okay, what? What went wrong here? And it's like you know, the last five years of my life felt just very performative. It's like this is what people are expecting me to do and so like, let me not disappoint and let me do it.
Speaker 2:I mean, even you know not to say I won't ever get married, but I had never considered marriage before my last partner, and it's just like. Well, now all my friends are getting married and having kids and I probably should.
Speaker 1:And if you start telling yourself I should, it's like you also shouldn't listen, should not listen.
Speaker 2:And so, yeah, just bringing it back to like you got to be honest with yourself. And do I want this because other people want it for me or do I actually want this for myself?
Speaker 1:when she said that to me over breadsticks, I was like you should have breadsticks. I know we should have recreated the vibes, but they were so perfect. But I just feel like yeah. When you said, like do you really want this for yourself?
Speaker 1:And I was like some of it, you know, and I've had to like rein it in a lot recently, like I'm going through a lot of changes and trying to make some of these decisions because in my season of yes, I said yes and I started a lot of things and I got to chill out because it just sucks to like reality's a thing. Well, yeah.
Speaker 2:When you're such a passionate person and multi-passionate, it's very easy to like ugh, just like the ideas are flowing and people are wanting to collaborate and do all the things. But, yeah, reeling it into that emotional authority, and it's like I need to get time to process, like I want to feel neutral. I don't want to be too excited or feel not good about it, I just want to be neutral and yes or no.
Speaker 1:And it's interesting because when I was trying to get to neutral 10 years ago, I was just numb, like if I didn't want to feel a negative thought. I couldn't feel a positive thought. So I sit in my joy a lot deeper than I sit in my grief. I sit in my joy a lot deeper than I sit in my grief, and that was something I had to manage myself and like learn how to take it in like fully, like my heart is like just sitting here and having this podcast and chatting with you and like having this connection and this conversation and all the things that I love. I'm just like ooh like, every time that I like schedule a podcast, I'm happy. Every time I talk to my friends, I'm so happy Every like. Every time that I like schedule a podcast, I'm happy. Every time I talk to my friends, I'm so happy. Every time I accidentally burp on the podcast, like sorry, you're my man, we got this, you know you'll fix it for me.
Speaker 2:But it's like I just don't feel any natural like objection to doing some of the things that I do, and that's where I was like I got to just keep of the things that I do, but that means you need to do it more Exactly.
Speaker 1:And that's where I was, like I got to just keep doing the things that I feel. Zero objection around, yeah, and zero like pull you know and don't drain me, like it doesn't drain me to leave this and be like okay, whereas like yeah, going to a networking event with tons of people.
Speaker 2:I go home and I'm like, ah yeah, I don't think people realize how much I have to prepare for those, because I do come off extroverted yeah.
Speaker 1:Remember the last one we were at? Everybody was like I'm an introvert and this is scary, like when they're introducing themselves. I was like should we just have introverts anonymous?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I am naturally an introvert, but when I first was starting my business, I was I need clients, and so I would force myself to go out alone. I remember the first thing I did was a concert to see gosh. What's that? There's a band of men who sing acapella or like.
Speaker 1:I think it's an Indiana thing and oh no, um, they go to bloom. Yeah, um it. Maybe they're out of Bloomington. It's another round, is that what it's called? Yeah, okay, because I lived in Bloomington for a little bit and it's a acapella group that like started in college.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I went to see them Another round and there's like another one that's like not in the college but like still does it no-transcript, like the Strong Women, strong Coffee, to where it's just a group that makes you feel so good, where it's like all the connections there just feel so genuine and people's heart chakras are just all the way open and you're like, yes, but typically it takes me I always know when I'm doing too much I'll change my outfit like three times before I go. Oh right, then I'll sit in the car for a little bit and then it's like I have a mild panic attack before I go to most things, and then I get there and then I'm fine.
Speaker 1:Well, because a lot of them aren't like strong women, strong coffee.
Speaker 2:Where they're they're, they're not all heart, yeah, you know, and like for people that go to a lot of chamber events and more like corporate and government my nose ring in and I cover my belly now for work, but I was very much a crop top girl.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I got a text actually yesterday from someone who works in banking and I hope to have her on the podcast someday. But she texted me and she said you're the reason like I dress the way I want to now at work, like I used to do it outside of work. But I didn't feel comfortable at work and I was like I love that. Every time I saw her I was like, wow, you look so cute. She's like oh, I can't wear this to the office or whatever. I'm like why not? You look great and well, my service, you can see like this is see-through.
Speaker 2:So it was just a little risky for the workplace, but I did buy office girly clothes.
Speaker 1:I was going to say. So you went from that entrepreneurial girly to office girly and yeah, I think for a time of rest and, you know, recovery in a way, recharge, like that discovery I meant of like discovery of yourself. It's like kind of nicely having someone else tell you what to do for a little bit and that's kind of like helps.
Speaker 2:I went into it, because everybody and I've gotten offers, even I'll, I'll be out to chatting and they'll be like what did you do? Oh, there's a room for rent here and it's like I'm just not ready to do that and I'm still getting over. I'm, I feel, pretty close to it. But you know, like the shame of closing, it's almost like people never encourage you to stop. Yeah, they're like no, you have to keep going. Keep going for everything, even if you're not happy, even if it's draining you of all your, even if it's bankrupting you, which closing a business, if you did not know, missed me Hold on, I got a.
Speaker 2:Wait, it's actually, yeah, it's so expensive and so it's like I needed to stop, and sometimes stopping is the best thing you can do in order to start again. So I'm still kind of in stop phase. So I took on some social media accounts. Yeah, that's about all I did during my break of working so that I could pay my rent, but it was bare bones, honey like, but I needed it. I needed a break, and so even now my I need a mental break where everything is not my responsibility. Yeah, I think sometimes people don't realize like, yes, it's, there's freedom and fun and you can do things you want to do when you have your own business, but you are also responsible for every single thing.
Speaker 2:So you don't really get a day off ever. It's like you can leave, but you know what? If your business catches on fire, you're still the person that has to deal with it. If my job is on fire right now, I hope no one's in the building, but I also like it's not something I have to worry about.
Speaker 1:Right, you don't have to do the recovery of it.
Speaker 2:I'd be sad I have a pothos starter in there, but other than that it's not my problem, and I'll give you some of my clippings if you ever need it. So, yeah, brain break, which I mean obviously not every job is like that, but I obviously picked a job that there was and I just I'm kind of a personality hire and I get to go be cute and meet people and tell them all the great things about the area and why they should be a member of the organization I'm with.
Speaker 1:Like hi, we're awesome, yeah, Join us. Like oh wait, I should have used my robot voice. I was just trying. Oh yeah, that would have been Where's my robot. Hi, join us. I don't know, you guys.
Speaker 1:I forgot that I had like sound effects even though I showed them off, All of the buttons, so many of them. I think it's because, like, like you, you know we've been talking through this and it's like even today I was like I need Adrian to look at this photo from a photo shoot we were doing earlier. I was like, is it good? My brain hurts, you know, and it's like to that place of like, yeah, not sleeping or making, I'm just making a lot of. You know, I have just as many positive conversations as I have what would be seen as negative ones, but I mean really standing up for myself and picking this business, but also picking myself and to stop the bleeding sometimes. Thank you, you have to. The thing that people respect about me is that I will make the decision, but it does take me a long time to like fully admit it, or I have that hope and I have to hold on to that for so long. But you know, retail has been down this year. It's been difficult, but and I've been finding money different places and that's great but, like there's been a lot of difficult conversations about, you know, with my landlords that I've had to have, and they've been gracious and we figured it out past that. Or or with my husband. You know what are we going to do with this?
Speaker 1:Our pipe burst in our house and it was like, ah, it started as like a $1,400 fix and then it was like 6,000.
Speaker 1:And then it was like kept going up from there.
Speaker 1:And now we have to get like restorative services done.
Speaker 1:So when things happen to your home and that safe space that you were like, well, every time I leave, I'm in this like little cozy space, and then those get disrupted, Like you really do have to, like I have to protect those things and my values, you know, lie within, of course, my business that I've created and all of that and all the people that I love here and all the people I interact with.
Speaker 1:But, at the end of the day, if I don't have a home like my shelter has literally almost crumbled in the last week and like I had to have conversations where that money that we planned to put into the business now has to be put into literal, like floorboards and water, like basics, a part of that that also like through my journey with the last leg of my business, is like and maybe it sounds self, I don't know, there is no judgment around it, but it's like this is mine, right, and what I do with it is, at the end of the day, is my decision, and I think so much of like, not just outside people, but even sometimes people you're working with.
Speaker 2:It's like want ownership and it's like, yes, I want you to buy in and to be a part, but at the end of the day, like I've made this thing and now I need to make these decisions for it and I don't know it sucks to suck.
Speaker 1:I mean everything's hard. You just pick your hard. You know it's hard to do any job it's hard to do, it's hard to feel stable anywhere it's. I mean, things can really change on the dime and you have to allow it when it comes. Yeah, I think that allowing word really hit me when I heard it. I was like allow, okay. I don't know Cause sometimes you hear buzzwords so much. It's like receiving and receiving. Yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, I even hate saying alignment now I know, but it's like because language changes too, and like you just.
Speaker 1:but it's like, because language changes too, and like you just. It's like hearing your favorite song, like you love it. It's on the radio, but then you've heard it 40,000 times. You're like I still think this matters, but this word got me to this new word, like we've almost evolved. So it's like if I can receive things but then I don't allow myself to just be open to things, then it's a different concept and I just really appreciated you sharing that with us. Yay, happy to do so. Well, I always love to tell everybody like we're all about putting money in the wallets of women, so would you like anyone to give you a follow? I know you're in your rest area or era area.
Speaker 2:Oh, both, I'm in your area and I'm resting.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So if you'd like to have the vibes out there, you're more than welcome to share them. But that's like what I like to say. It's like how do we put money into your wallet?
Speaker 2:You can just cash at me. But yeah, you can follow. I mean, the pages are still up. I still do makeup occasionally, Like I have one in August. I was going to say I feel like I— I will do it for some special people Would love you to do my makeup for things. So yeah, the Beauty Room EVV on Instagram is still up Also, according to Kaina. It's completely fine. I do a lot of things on there.
Speaker 1:It's more your personal like like Instagram.
Speaker 2:I do some contract work for the tourism board in Indiana, so lots of stuff on there for that Also. I love all the places in Louisville so I'm usually posting she's out on the town. But sometimes I'm what people don't realize. I'm a daytime girly, so I will do anything up until about seven to nine. Nine o'clock on a weekday is typically where I would like to be at if I have to be out, and then on the weekends I don't want to be outside past 6 o'clock and that's if I've been out all day brunching. So I like to be outside but not like late.
Speaker 1:Yeah, at like 9, I'm like in bed.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, Someone asked me to do something. It was like a comedy show or whatever. The doors open at 10 o'clock. I said I don't think that I can commit to that.
Speaker 1:No, it's cause we in our 35s yeah, 35, yeah birthday's coming up.
Speaker 1:Yay, this is like kinda halfway between I know, oh gosh, I love 35 year olds that's oddly specific well, I love 30 year olds yeah, 30s because I mean, obviously you just have a lot of references with them and you've gone through a lot of similar experiences, but it's really fun. Well, thank you so much, kaina, for coming and vibing with me and just talking through like all these things, like I think it's important for people to know the different stories of women and their stories of their money, journeys and everything in between. So, and I just really appreciate it, thank you for having me. Yeah, I just appreciate this connection with you. So, thanks, no problem. What was that? Have you seen that one TikTok? That's like the feminine urge to text your bestie, like how much fun you had hanging out with them, like right after you leave no, but I mean I feel like maybe I've seen similar things, but not that specific one because you texted me right after we not right after, but that evening and I like showed my husband.
Speaker 1:I was like my friend texts me, she had fun with me today, and he was like that's cool. I was like, yeah, just because I just love when things get out of like the work phase. You know it's so nice. So that's how I feel. So watch out, I'm going to text you later. Thanks so much for the connection today. Yeah, you can text me first this time. Okay, I'll leave the ball in my court, all right deal. Well, thank you so much again and I just love you so much. So, thank you, thank you. Well, moneymakers, until next time, go out there and make that money. If you want to put more money into the wallets of women, like we do, then check out our website, the woman owned walletcom, and we can't wait to continue the conversation on our social media. Thank you for listening to Woman-Owned Wallet, the podcast.
